From NAS Oceana to NSA Souda Bay

Author Message   Jack T. Paxton Senior Member Username: Jpaxton Post Number: 714 Registered: 07-2003 Posted From: 24.27.231.67 Posted on Tuesday, December 22, 2009 - 07:57 pm:    Gene: As the guy once wrote: "...yeah, but. Did I have a great time? Yes. Of course it cost me money: Yes. Was the hassle worth it? Yes. Would I do it again? You bet! We had a great five days on Crete and all but one night in Lodging. Nice place, great people. Go for it!   Gene Williams Advanced Member Username: Gene_w Post Number: 280 Registered: 06-2003 Posted From: 94.71.75.47 Posted on Sunday, December 20, 2009 - 07:29 am:    After a private e-mail or two, I'm thinking that I should have prefaced my original post on this thread by stating what I wrote in my 'travel-blog' to family and friends, namely this: We are having and expect to continue to have a great time on our trip to Crete via NSA Souda Bay. If my note(s) make it sound like this trip has only been a series of mishaps and bad things happening to us – that is not my intent. The mishaps and incidents just seem be easier to write about than the many many times we've said, “Wow, that's really pretty!” or “Yum, this lamb dish (or whatever) is exceptionally tasty!” or “Stelios went waaaay out of his way to be accommodating and to help us out.” or Hey! That's really neat!" Plus I wanted to provide info for those who are going to follow us to Souda Bay so they could learn from things that happened to us, to be prepared and to be able to plan accordingly. Remember (and remind me) as I bitch, that it cost us nothing out of pocket to fly from Virginia Beach, Virginia to the Greek island of Crete. Of course I'm not counting having "pre-paid" for the flight by serving those dark and stormy nights in the Indian Ocean, the cost of gasoline to drive from home to Norfolk and back, the cost of lodging on our drive up and back, the cost of lodging at NAS Oceana ($50/night) or lodging at Lajes AB ($38/night) and the cost of the bag full of snacks my wife brought from home (Did you know that Tallahassee is the only place in world one can buy crackers? <grin>) Merry Christmas! Gene W.   Gene Williams Advanced Member Username: Gene_w Post Number: 279 Registered: 06-2003 Posted From: 94.71.75.47 Posted on Sunday, December 20, 2009 - 07:10 am:    GJZ's question was answered in a thread on the General Space-a Info Forum Gene W.   John D. Moderator Username: John_d Post Number: 3681 Registered: 06-2003 Posted From: 86.42.129.81 Posted on Saturday, December 19, 2009 - 08:43 pm:    Please respond to GJZ's request for info on access numbers in the duplicate thread at: http://www.pepperd.com/cgi-bin/spacea/show.cgi?tpc=2&post=191307#POST191307 Thanks!   GJZ Advanced Member Username: Candleinthesand Post Number: 258 Registered: 05-2006 Posted From: 71.38.211.27 Posted on Saturday, December 19, 2009 - 08:30 pm:    Uh-oh, Gene Williams wrote: "Lesson learned: If you fly into NSA Souda Bay, don't leave the pax terminal without giving your name and other info to the security briefer and getting an access number. If you try to get into NSA Souda Bay having arrived on Crete via other forms of transport (i.e. ferry or commercial air) I don't know how you are going to get an base access number. It's possible but it's probably going to be a convoluted process. THAT is going to be a problem for us and one we'd sure like info on to solve it. We're in process of planning trip to Crete for our 25th wedding anniversary in April. We want to use Crete as a base to take ferries to other Greek Islands and to fly to Istanbul from Rhodes (only way I've found to get there except from Athens) How can we get back on base to fly back home if we don't have and can't get an access number?   D.B.M UK Senior Member Username: Overlandrover Post Number: 5442 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 88.108.91.198 Posted on Saturday, December 19, 2009 - 01:05 pm:    Gene, just keep taking the pills. Hope you have a good next 8 days, and don't have problems getting back on base for the flight that will be leaving in 30 minutes. Still have snow here, so best you stay there.   Gene Williams Advanced Member Username: Gene_w Post Number: 276 Registered: 06-2003 Posted From: 94.71.95.157 Posted on Saturday, December 19, 2009 - 11:50 am:    Another "lesson learned" at Souda Bay: I reported that we were told we'd have to "renew/extend/get-a-new" Souda Bay access number every 3 days. At 14:30 (2:30 PM for you USAFers) Friday afternoon, I called the Souda Bay MVRO (motor vehicle registration office) I was told (with a tone of impatience, I might add) that I should have called before 14:00 inasmuch as the "Greek Major" had departed for the weekend and I could not get a number until "next Monday." I wasn't particularly worried about the next 8 days because we'd be staying at a hotel out in the community and would not be transiting the gate until we were ready fly out. However, I didn't want to go through the same hassle of getting an access number that I'd gone through before. Before I got the Command Duty Officer involved I wanted to get my s*** in one sock, as they say. I walked towards the MVRO and while standing inside the metal barrier (making sure I hadn't left the base, I asked the Greek guard if my access number was still valid. I assured me that it was. In the MVRO, I told the same Petty Officer that I'd dealt with before about my phone call for access number extension. She then proceeded to give different numbers for each 3 day period of my stay on Crete. Sitting in a corner, a young Petty Officer spoke up and said to the LPO, "Oh, I took that call. I'd didn't know what he was talking about, so I told him to call back Monday." WTF! So, why didn't they give me all the numbers when I was there initially? Rhetorical question. So, why didn't the PO ask someone else in the office to help me when I called? Another rhetorical question. If the MVRO can't give out access numbers when the "Greek Major is on liberty, what do they do for someone arriving "after hours" via some other means than military air? I dunno. Why am I taking MVRO off my Christmas card list? We all know the answer to that one. Lesson learned: Damned if I know. It's like the 3 laws of thermodynamics. #1 You can't win #2 You can't lose. (actually you can) #3 You can't get out of the game once you're in it. Gene W.   Joe Lippo Advanced Member Username: Momojoe Post Number: 349 Registered: 06-2006 Posted From: 138.163.106.71 Posted on Friday, December 18, 2009 - 02:16 am:    NAS Oceana must have a problem in the Operations Dept. When I was an Operations Leading Petty Officer(LPO), had I answered the question "What flights are inbound today" with an "I don't know", the Operations Officer would have found himself a new LPO before lunch! Sounds like somebody just didn't want to go through the message traffic. Other than that, I learned a lot from your post, since I have been kicking around some ideas about going to Greece/Crete...   Gene Williams Advanced Member Username: Gene_w Post Number: 274 Registered: 06-2003 Posted From: 94.71.95.157 Posted on Friday, December 18, 2009 - 01:54 am:    Danny: Our Souda Inn reservation was secured by credit card. Ill send you a PM about the location of the couches. I don't want to tip my hand until we leave - may have to use those things again. Rest assured the couches were indoors. The access numbers are for entry into the "Greek gate" And apply mostly to those folks who are not "permanent party."Part of the status of forces agreement. (I would have written "SOFA" but that might have gotten confused with the "couches." <grin>) Don, The aircrew had nothing to do with faxing the manifest. The security briefer faxed what the terminal personnel gave him. I don't fault him (too much) There were a lot of very tired folks milling around in a pretty small space when he showed up. Gene W   Danny Hamilton Senior Member Username: Dannyhamilton Post Number: 524 Registered: 03-2004 Posted From: 68.225.115.15 Posted on Friday, December 18, 2009 - 12:01 am:    Thanks for the trip report, Gene. Too bad we Spats have to get that "access number" upon arrival. Sounds like a real hassle. Your problems would have been easier to handle had the crew faxed the SECOND page of the manifest to the MVRO. Wouldn't your reserved room have been saved for you if you had placed it on a credit card? One thing you wrote aroused my curiosity: "The wife and I spent the rest of the night on two couches I found." WHERE did you "find" couches? I'm picturing you and your wife sleeping outdoors near a dumpster on couches being thrown away! Surely that was not the case. Tell us more about your fortunate finds.   D.B.M UK Senior Member Username: Overlandrover Post Number: 5436 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 88.108.91.198 Posted on Thursday, December 17, 2009 - 06:50 pm:    Good report Gene. One trip to the States, I came back with the guys and gals from Oceana. Good group as you said, but seems you have to know about flights beforehand so you can brief them about it. Long term parking can be a problem, just hope you will be okay with your car when you get back.   Gene Williams Advanced Member Username: Gene_w Post Number: 273 Registered: 06-2003 Posted From: 94.71.95.157 Posted on Thursday, December 17, 2009 - 06:04 pm:    Space-A from NAS Oceana (Virginia Beach, VA) to NSA Souda Bay December 2009 We had been planning a December trip to Souda Bay, Crete, Greece for about 4 months. Our best bet for a hop appeared to be the bi-weekly Patriot Express from NAS Norfolk that stopped at Souda Bay. As the time for the trip grew closer I began to worry that I had no “plan B” to get to Souda Bay. Buying commercial tickets, especially “refundable” tickets, seemed to be outside our budget. So, I began to look for alternative hops. The NAS Whidbey Island (on their web site) was showing a C-9 flight from Whidbey to Oceana and thence to “down-range” with a stop at Souda Bay. That flight was two days in advance of the Patriot Express. A little earlier than I had planned to leave, but it would give us the Pat Ex as our “plan B.” I called the Oceana pax terminal and inquired about the flight (show time, seat release, etc) They said they didn't have that flight on their schedule. When I quoted the mission number I was passed over to NAS Operations. After a little search, message traffic was found concerning the flight, they confirmed that it was on the schedule and gave me some approximate info. So, we set off for Oceana, from North Florida, by POV. On the designated day, I walked into the Oceana Pax terminal and asked about the flight. The Petty Officer on watch (it was a weekend day) didn't have any knowledge of the flight. He walked me over to the Operations desk (same building, separated from the Pax terminal by a glass wall.) The Ops duty officer, a civilian, couldn't find the previously found message. After I told him the mission number he recognized the call sign of VR-56, home-ported at Oceana. He called VR-56 and learned the flight from Whidbey was still scheduled to arrive that day. After a RON at Oceana it would depart the next day. (OBTW: He did give me the flights stops after it left Oceana. I told him about the "new" policy at Navy Jax (see other threads). He stated, That don't make any sense.") Lessons learned: 1) if you can determine the mission designator, it really helps. 2) some (all?) VR squadrons have different call signs for CONUS flights and OCONUS flights. I asked the pax agent and the ops duty officer about Oceana long term parking. They weren't sure, but thought the long term parking was under the control of Base Security. I called the “Desk Sargent” (who happened to be another Petty Officer) who told me that Base Security had no control over the long term parking lot and it was controlled by MWR (the morale, welfare, and recreation department) According to the Desk Sargent, “We only tow cars from there.” Well, that wasn't encouraging! I mentioned to her that MWR was closed for the weekend and wouldn't open until the next morning, after the flight was due to depart. Her reply, “Well it seems you have a problem!” Well, duh! I asked to see the Watch Commander and was told he wasn't available until just before the watch changed. I left, went back later, and told my tale of woe to the Watch Commander. After a lengthy conversation (which included discussing the potential expense of having my car towed) he found a compromise solution. I left the Base Police office, with a dashboard chit protecting my car from ticketing and towing in my hand. I suppose I won't really know if I'm out of the woods until I return to where I left my car. The C-9 hop the next day was delayed about 3 hours while a tire on the aircraft was replaced. We RON'ed at Lajes AB. The on-ward flight was delayed about 4 hours due to inability to refuel the aircraft during a thunderstorm. The hop stopped at NAS Sigonella to pick up a 23 man contingent that had also departed NAS Whidbey Island but had a 3 day delay at Willow Grove and 2 days at Sigonella because of a bent then broke C-9. We arrived at Souda Bay about 9 hours later than originally scheduled. I wasn't worried because I had a reservation at the Souda Inn. Shoulda been worried! Three of us spats got the required Souda Bay security briefing and when I asked for our “access number” was told we'd have to get them at MVRO (motor vehicle registration office) the following morning after they opened. More about that later. We walked into the billeting office at about 01:00 confident that we had a place to sleep for the night and the next couple of days. We were informed that since we had failed to show up before 21:00 ( 9 PM) our reservation was negated. The good news was since we finally got there we wouldn't get charged for “no-show.” The bad news was because of the unexpected surge by the bunch we picked up at Sigonella, there were no VOQ beds available! The wife and I spent the rest of the night on two couches I found. When morning broke bright, I called Stelios Tzamariadaki, at Horafaki Car Rental, where we were renting a car. He was able to locate a reasonably priced hotel room for us.. After we picked up the car, he led us to the hotel. Nice guy - that Stelios. But... back to the missing access number. When I and another spat went to MVRO the next morning, the first question we were asked, “What's your access number.” We told the Petty Officer that we'd been told we'd get our numbers at MVRO. She said, “That was a mistake. I'll have to verify that you came into Souda Bay space-a.” She checked the faxed copy of our C-9's manifest. We were not on the manifest she had. Since the passengers on the flight from Whidby Island were on the first page and we as space-a passengers had been added later ,we were on a second page that hadn't been faxed over. Next part of the problem: I had left my wife waiting in the lobby of the Souda Inn. In order to get access numbers, MVRO would have to see her in person and verify her ID. Since I didn't have an access number, I couldn't return to the Souda Inn to get my wife. After a lot of back-n-forth it was decided that my wife would walk to MVRO ( not a long walk but not particularly close either.) Soon, another hurdle was cleared. The Petty Officer at MVRO would be our sponsor, even tho' that role is usually filled by the briefing Security Officer. Eventually, we got our access numbers. But they have to be “re-newed” every 3 days. If a holiday or weekend disrupts the 3 day cycle then the renewal has to be done before the 3 days expire. Lesson learned: If you fly into NSA Souda Bay, don't leave the pax terminal without giving your name and other info to the security briefer and getting an access number. If you try to get into NSA Souda Bay having arrived on Crete via other forms of transport (i.e. ferry or commercial air) I don't know how you are going to get an base access number. It's possible but it's probably going to be a convoluted process. Lesson learned: NAS Oceana pax terminal is aware of many out-bound VR-56 flights to various CONUS locations. They don't know much about flights in-bound to Oceana. The out-bound destinations are mostly in the Navy circuit but also many to (and I suppose returning from) several Army installations. If you want to fly space-a from Oceana, don't call the VR-56 ops department. I was told by a VR-56 pilot “They don't appreciate such calls.” Since Oceana does not have a flight info recording, getting info about the origination location of flights into Oceana maybe hard to come by. Obviously, Oceana accepts space-a passengers but they don't encourage them. This is enough “lessons learned” for one trip. Since we are going to be here (on Crete) for another 10 days, I won't be surprised if something else turns up. Gene W.