Ft Worth to Elmendorf er...Whidbey Is...

Author Message   Phil Doubleman Senior Member Username: Phil Post Number: 1612 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 68.35.26.65 Posted on Wednesday, May 26, 2010 - 03:01 pm:    Sorry... forgot that this was a Trip Report thread.   Phil Doubleman Senior Member Username: Phil Post Number: 1611 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 68.35.26.65 Posted on Wednesday, May 26, 2010 - 01:40 pm:    TR, Every base has a primary mission. Almost every AF base and even some Army bases (Biggs for one) have a primary mission that does not preclude them from performing the tasks necessary to permit the Space A benefit. Ft. Hood is just trying to get away with the least work possible.   William Standage Senior Member Username: Charlie13 Post Number: 1122 Registered: 07-2004 Posted From: 75.172.58.212 Posted on Wednesday, May 26, 2010 - 05:29 am:    John, Good post, and very good tips about Ft Hood. This subject has been covered in depth in past years and your report was good since it brings the problem back to the top of the pile. Bottom line as I see it; nothing has changed at Gray Army Air Field, Ft Hood, as regards to space-a in the last four years. They have always been very adverse to providing any support for space-a. So a word to the wise, yes you can find lots of flights going into Ft Hood and your can get a ride in, but never out! Just like the oppressive heat in central Texas, space-a problems there never seem to change.   TR Advanced Member Username: Travel_ready Post Number: 245 Registered: 06-2003 Posted From: 74.192.161.189 Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 11:30 pm:    John, just a qualifier- Fort Hood's primary mission, (as it should be), is to organize, train and equip combat power (troop units) for deployment. It is one of the Army's premier power projection platforms and the leadership at Hood does this mission very well. TRANSCOM has a big part to play in Ft Hood's mission of moving entire units into theater and return. That doesn't mean that Space-A support shouldn't be considered or conducted from Gray AAF, just that the Army has a much more focused view of getting boots on the ground and getting them back home. Again, a cultural thing based on its primary mission, and perhaps not seeing a bigger beneficial picture that Space-A support could provide there, if exercised. I'm not making excuses for the shabby treatment you experienced, just attempting to place some perspective on the situation there.   John Civick Advanced Member Username: John6412 Post Number: 282 Registered: 07-2008 Posted From: 166.188.144.142 Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 10:52 pm:    Thanks TR, I thought I'd be flamed due to the post! It is sad that no cares about the lower ranking troops - or any troops apparently. I sent a form thanks to Carmen and will post the results if I receive a reply. The entire issue is leadership at the top levels or lack thereof.   TR Advanced Member Username: Travel_ready Post Number: 244 Registered: 06-2003 Posted From: 74.192.161.189 Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 10:04 pm:    John, I feel your pain, having been assigned at Fort Hood as an Army Aviator for years and served there as a military contractor after retirement. The sad irony is that Ft Hood has enormous potential as a Space-A site for the 100,000+ AD and retiree community there. The 11,000 ft Gray AAF runway is joint use with Killeen. Killeen's (new) terminal is just on the other side of the runway from base ops, so making commercial connections to DFW and IAH is possible for transient SPATs and adding to their revenue. Killeen also offers plenty of hotel options that meet or beat Army lodging. Gray AAF also has a fairly large, modern PAX terminal building just up the road from base ops. All the infrastructure is there to accommodate SPATs. TSA support could be augmented from the Killeen airport on an as needed basis. This is part manpower issue, part cultural issue and part bad attitude. Your description of the staff there is, unfortunately, accurate. Most of those that work there are retired Army Warrant Officer pilots working as civil service dispatchers/safety officers and airfield managers. They have a lock on how things operate on that airfield due to their expertise. Any added workload on them is not welcome, I can assure you, and will continue to be resisted. It's too bad that the USAF doesn't operate an Aerial Support Squadron there on a full time basis. I suspect the optempo of USAF flights there probably doesn't justify it. Personally, I sure wish the Space-A support situation there were better, since I only live about 30 minutes away- but I won't get my hopes up. I suspect the senior leadership at Fort Hood really doesn't want to open what they feel could be a can of worms with supporting SPATs, partly out of having enough on their plate, partly out of a perception of not having enough dedicated resources to adequately support it and partly because they aren't being fed accurate information about how Space-A works and how it could be a benefit for their soldiers, families, retirees and the community at large with just some extra effort and caring on the part of their support staff.   John Civick Advanced Member Username: John6412 Post Number: 281 Registered: 07-2008 Posted From: 166.188.11.82 Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 09:25 pm:    PR, I spoke to the shuttle driver who specifically stated that they would go out to the airfield and pick up people and that they had done it before. Perhaps the hotel should have commented that they had a shuttle service for arriving guests? And Carmen I will check out that website-Thanks!   Carmon R Senior Member Username: Ckroy Post Number: 955 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 143.214.160.67 Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 09:15 pm:    The Army has this neat thing to keep track of how they are doing called ICE (interactive customer evaluation). I have posted the airfield ops link below. I would recommend that you let that installation commander know that their airfield is not customer friendly. It might be helpful to someone else if the airfield becomes aware that their lack of services is noted and reported. http://ice.disa.mil/index.cfm?fa=card&site_id=73&service_provider_id=82965   PR Senior Member Username: Pretzlaff Post Number: 1677 Registered: 06-2003 Posted From: 67.190.52.82 Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 08:46 pm:    In case any of us ever ends up at the Fort Hood airfield, what is the name and number of the cab company?? Also, how did you verify that lodging would actually come out and get folks at the airfield?? Depending when the folks at Fort Hood get deployed and un-deployed, there can be quite a few planes going there. I have seen them from McChord and also Rota, as well as others.   John Civick Advanced Member Username: John6412 Post Number: 280 Registered: 07-2008 Posted From: 166.188.11.82 Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 08:33 pm:    The wife and I noted that there was a flight from Ft Worth to Elmendorf and we prepared. Had a suite for 3 days at Elmendorf, bus to Homer to catch the ferry to Kodiak, reservations at Kodiak for 5 days (Admiral's Suite), ferry back and then planned on taking a cruise from either Seward or Whittier to Vancouver and then Whidbey for a flight back to our car. Alas, the flight was cancelled so we took a flight to Whidbey instead. Easy to reserve a room for 7 days at whidbey, rented a car and toured around, rode the ferry to Sidney BC, ate clam chowder and then a flight was scheduled to return to Ft Worth and after preparing to catch that flight found it was cancelled. So we took the next best thing, a C-17 to Ft Hood in Texas. Only 3 caught the flight including the two of us. Uneventful flight, great, great crew that let the wife sit in the cockpit on the last 45 minutes of flight. She thought she was in Heaven with the clouds so close! On landing at Ft Hood, the heat was stiffling and the other passenger told us nothing was at Ft Hood, no terminal and on a previous flight to Hood, he flew with an Army 2 star and the general talked it up with him until landing. At that point the general reverted from a human being to an Army General and the General told him to have a great time...and he departed with his welcoming vehicle leaving the guy sitting at the end of the runway in the heat. He had to walk in 100+ temperature to the tower which was approximately 1.5 miles, call a cab and pay $40.00 plus dollars which enabled him to reach civilization. Hood is a HUGE post and the runway is around 35 miles from lodging. Enough of that, we three caught a cab for $40 to the Army Hotel on post and paid $71.00 for the night as compared to the AF $39 and the Navy $49. Sticker shock but we had a cool room. After we arrrived at the Hotel, we found out that they have a hotel shuttle and they could've came out and picked us up! The wife said that Ft Hood had a feeling of sadness and couldn't wait to leave. We rented a car from Hertz and made it back to Ft Worth NAS and got on base without a sticker, only ID. Glad to be back. Oh yes, one of the guys at the building near the tower at Hood really got into a tirade about space a people on how they didn't have the facilities and it cost too much to care for them and he ranted for around 15 minutes untiol I talked him down and then he yielded and gave us a cab number. (I think he was angry because he was put out of the Army after 11 years in a force reduction- he used to fly helicopters). Then as we were there, the pilot of the C-17 (remember I said they were great, great guys?) came in and asked if they had any space a passengers and the guy who was ranting said we don't process space a passengers here to which the pilot blurted, "What?" He couldn't believe what he heard being AF I guess. He was in shock and walked out shaking his head in disbelief. Three (3) C-17's were coming in to Ft Hood that week and they had no one that wanted to go to Charleston and be processed on the entire Ft Hood complex??? All the pilot had to do was say I'm taking x number of passengers and they would put them on the manifest and they'd fly at no cost to Charleston. It is obvious to the crew of the C-17 as well as the passengers who just got off the aircraft that the Army does not look after it's own. I'm not going to fly into Ft Hood again unless it is a last resort based on the heat, lack of caring for their troops but most importantly the poor attitude of the individual at base ops. They weren't doing ANYTHING and complained when we arrived. I wasn't going to post this but folks need to know when they set foot off the aircraft, they are on their own and cab fare is expensive unless one calls the Army Hotel for transportation. Incidentally, the hotel shuttle will take one virtually anywhere off post or on post. I thank God that I'm Air Force! I realize that the failure to process space a passengers at Ft Hood may be isolated and not throughout the Army but it made a huge statement to me. I don't mean to offend any Army folks out there but the treament rendered to AD at Hood was deplorable!